Debate : Who is Respnsible? - Page 9

Posted: 11 years ago
Originally posted by KS_Shreya





You said everything so well. Much of what I wished to say has been said by you.

The worst part is that the society wasn't bothered to help. For 2 hours, these 2 victims lay there and people just walked past them. Where's the justice in that? If only there was a way to identify these people who left them to die. They should be punished as well!

Well said. 

I used to wonder if it was the common public mentality that was to blame. But this incident has affected us, the indian public quite strongly. 

Now after reading comments by politicians, am wondering is it due to the fact that the ones who are supposed to be advocating women protection laws and their safety are indulging in these crimes...no wonder then, their attitude shows no respect or sympathy.  Policemen who take consistently good action get transferred...they are used as scapegoats by both common public and politicians.  Judges too have gotten transferred or are made to quit.  Those committing the crimes are getting more and more comfortable doing so 😡. 

Even the women who made it big in political circles has had someone else backing her up...have very rarely seen women politicians taking a strong stand. most often, they are found agreeing to what's already been said and been backed up by a senior/male politician.  

In reality, most people are used to seeing women retreating away in shame due to these kind of rapes. no one expected someone to strongly fight back as done by the Delhi girl.  Even in mainstream cinema, the women are left crying or commit suicide.  Out of sight, Out of mind.  

In addition, poverty and lack of adequate infrastructure have broken down the moral values over time.  Am happy that at least now more and more women are not afraid to voice their complaints and that crimes are getting reported (instead of being swept away under the carpet).  That is the first crucial step.
Edited by newbie2011 - 11 years ago
Posted: 11 years ago
Originally posted by meghasingh



 
And there's no denying that the middle class is apathetic most of the time. The rape victim was a middle-class educated professional, that's why people were so enraged. What about Dalits and sex workers. You will find around one-fourth of  the people who were so 'enraged' will suddenly shut their mouths.
-indigoblues.


@indigoblues...so true... you know I'm too much sensitive on any issue connected to women, so to this gang rape too. It bothered me more bcz the statements and comments after the incident...short clothes, late night plans, this and that. Now i do wear mini skirts, shorts, like late night parties...so do i deserve to get raped...?? so this case horrified me beyond limits... so by any means i am not saying that what happened with her was something which is acceptable or some light matter.

But now coming to sex workers and dalits...how many time one talk and debate over these groups... in some rural areas it's common that the lower caste women are raped, and there's hardly any complain against the wrong doers, and it hardly gains any attention. and sex workers...if u know then the worst u can call a woman is the word for a woman sex worker...so people will even think abt them...forget it.

Now to everyone, in india 99.9% people are nothing but hypocrite group of people... everyone is saying that rape is wrong, but many with a remark she shouldn't had gone out late night...wow...


I think more than her economic/cast status IMO it was the fact that the crime was committed in such a public place that caused the outrage.

Because people take that bus everyday and people feel it could have been any one of them. 

As for the chauvinistic view that women are at fault for ' dressing inappropriately' and 'were at the wrong place at the wrong time',they sicken me.

Our society preaches don't get raped instead of don't rape. 

Posted: 11 years ago
@dmgloverforever
agreed on all your points!
but sex and rape are two very different things!!
Posted: 11 years ago
Originally posted by Rockerchic




I think more than her economic/cast status IMO it was the fact that the crime was committed in such a public place that caused the outrage.

Because people take that bus everyday and people feel it could have been any one of them.

As for the chauvinistic view that women are at fault for ' dressing inappropriately' and 'were at the wrong place at the wrong time',they sicken me.

Our society preaches don't get raped instead of don't rape.


yup thats sickens even me!!
but sorry to say that inappropriate clothes do call rapes
Posted: 11 years ago
Its not about revealing clothes or modern women in cities who get raped!
 What abt the tribal women, the adivasis, the rural women, the little girls who get raped?
 They dont wear modern dresses, they dont have cell phones! Still they are assaulted. raped!
 Its because those men are beastly, sadistic, inhuman monsters who only know how to assert their power over females of any age and class by raping them, by injuring their pride and dignity! Basically these men hate all females, even their own mothers! Any man who loves and respects his mother cannot commit such crimes! 

30 years ago, when I was a teenager growing up in India, we wore salwars and later on wore saris to college!  STILL we were groped, touched indecently in public buses, we were heckled on streets with lewd comments! 
Even after my marriage when I went grocery shopping (wearing sari and sindoor) I was subjected to lewd comments from some low class men passing by...so this thing has existed in India since a long time! 
As a teen in Delhi, I heard stories of little girls being raped, women being molested on DTC buses, and ALL this was 30 years ago! 

Nothing has changed in terms of mentality and perversion of Indian male...only difference is now rape cases are reported more by media and anger and outrage spreads because of social media.
 I am feeling hopeful seeing the outrage and fury after the brutal rape case in Delhi! 
I REALLY hope this time Indian justice system does something concrete abt it and Indian public takes these matters more seriously. If law doesnt punish them then the public should take matters into their own hands!

Everytime a pervert gropes a girl on a bus and she protests, beat him up!
 Everytime a stalker follows a woman and harasses her, she should complain loudly and public should beat up the stalker. 
Acid should NOT be sold in stores for easy purchase by these criminals! 
Women should keep some sort of weapon with them...like a knife or even a gun, definitely pepper spray and chilli spray!
Posted: 11 years ago
pallavi, i agree with you... it feels stupid when dresses are blamed for molestation and rapes... and I feel more stupid when these things are said by a female...
and those who try to connect rape with men's desires and sex, and the way they think...bullshit...especially this thing to girls who assert that there is a relation bw a men desires and rapes. The men who rape a woman, for them it's a way to assert their power over women, they hardly think about anything like feelings because for them woman is simply a sex toy, a commodity which is for their usage...that's all. After this incident i talked to many guys with whom i am able to share everything, everyone said that this is just a presumption which has been injected by patriarchy into girls mind.
You know we do have hands but we dont go around slapping people, same applies to desires, men do have desires but they dont go around raping women.
Posted: 11 years ago
@ meghasingh...Yes its all abt power over a female!
Please read this article written by a Nigerian woman, Nigeria has a rape culture, basically the same mentality and problems as India.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jan/14/nigeria-rape-india-culture

Particularly this passage stands out in the article which applies to India too:

"Rape in its simplest form is not just an urgent, unexpected sexual desire that needs to be satisfied. Instead, it is the violent expression of power against another. Rape is primarily about power and its abuse. Within the Nigerian context, it is the punishment for wishing to be independent, for daring to threaten the status quo, the societal power dynamics. It is not about modesty neither is it about what the victim wore or her behaviour because as we all know, modestly dressed women are raped all the time. How does one explain the rape of a minor? When a woman is raped, the perpetrator is simply saying the victim's body is his to take with or without her consent and when a society as a whole fails to protect the victim and punish the perpetrator, that society is consenting that indeed the woman's body is up for taking with or without her consent."

Edited by pallavi25 - 11 years ago
Posted: 11 years ago
pallavi...that's what thing is... after this whole incident i's shocked and shook to the deepest core, i had even nightmares, because it could be me...and still when people try to say that this is all about provoking, desires and sex...it's bullshit.
i'll say it's about the mentality, the environment the way u r brought up...i talked to my cousin(he's my bestest friend too, and we do talk abt everything) that is it ever possible that when mostly people say that clothes can provoke...he said it's crap... u may find someone sexy or hot in some dresses but rape isn't about sex or anything like that... he said sex would be a bliss but it's impossible even to think that how can rape be related to something so cruel and so inhumane as rape as sex is a purely one of the basic human desires...
Posted: 11 years ago
 Provocative Act?  Pop Culture? or the Mentality? all blame game for me

i agree these things do provoke but they didn't give men a lisence to habendum  law & justice & rape womens.provocative act by modern women or pop culture cause rape it is a statement of sick mind there are cases of female child rape,womens in villages are raped too who dosen't belong to any pop culture nor done any provocative act.why we womens not hear any such statement from a group of girls '' the modern provocative act of the modern boy cause rape''.

What exactly is the root cause according to you?

poor very very poor law & security is the main reason to let such incidents happen.goverment should wakeup & take insiatives to stop such shameful acts.there should be only death panelty for rapist.if the rape is done in public places the rapiest should be hang to death in public..
public ignorence specialy womens ignorence.every women face it we face it every day abusive acts, lewd comments,lustful eyes. first we get scared of it then later we start ingnoring them & finaly we become use of it.why??? even in public places when some nasty comments were passed most of girls ignore & say don't want to creat a scene &public just stand like dummies to watch & say we can't risk our life. why not to stop it on the first place.how many of us acted in such situation to defend our respect.even people are afraid to make a poloice call in these situations.our silence give them courage & today we are being targeted by these sick minds. i wish a law too pass against such dummies who just stand & watch.as a human we should know our responsibility & act.

since the day the world is created evil & good is present. so there is no way to stop rape permanetaly but we can discuss the things which will decrease the cases & such incidents to happen.

Death panelty for rapist

after this case a example should be set to make these sick mind think 1000 time before attempt rape.only death panelty for rapist.


No alcohol

why only drugs are banned alcohol should be also banned.  drunkers should not be allowed on public places like roads,busstand ,parks,cinemas they even shouldn't allowed to travel or take a taxi or auto.any person drunk should not be allowed to outdoors. it dosen't matter he/she is enough consious or not.if bunch of drunkers are found on any place immediate call should be make to police to catch them before they cause any trouble.
i don't understand the liquid poison which snach your senses of humanity & give you dieases like cancer is allowed it should be banned.

every girl should learn self defence

we are working whith shoulder to shoulder with the mens in any field we are not behind them but a fact we can't deny mens are physicaly stronger then womens. i request please every girls should learn self defence. women self defence should be teached to girls in school level as a subject. if you are a mother,father,brother or a elder sister please make sure your daughters your sisters learn self defence even if your are a house wife or over 30 its never too late to learn.if you can afford self defence classes fees well enough but if you can't you can learn it through internet.it gives you self confidence it make you physicaly capable to deal with hard situations.i my self is a green belt & Krav Maga trained by my brother.

respect women dignity

Every culture was influenced.thats how it evolved.but yes transition does appear frustrating..as some take the worst out of both.
as a women we know how to carry our selves.we know our culture & traditions we follow them & respect them. so as a women respect your dignity.


Posted: 11 years ago
You know when a girl is raped many things leave her forever. However that is not because of the girl. When some one steals it is because he is a theif not because people have a lot of money. When some one kills it is because he is a murderer and does not value life not because the other person has done wrong. When a students fails his exams it is because he did not study. When a person passes his exam it is because they studied for that. So when someone rapes it is because he wanted to do it and he has no value for the laws set by society. He is a criminal and why someone commits a crime is very simple- because he had a motive and because he simply wanted to. To prevent that women simply have to stop blaming themselves. This things happen and you have to be patient. Remember one out of two women in India are raped every single day by their husbands. It is because those husbands want to and have the opportunity. Think at least you are lucky that you have the opportunity to have endured only once and will not have to face him ever again if you want to. May Allah give them patience.
 

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