Ayodhya:Ram Janmabhoomi

Yes, I am talking about the reconstruction of the Ram temple which is more famously called the demolition of Babri Masjid😃,on Dec26 1992

I think I was in 7th grade when this incident happened and I remember feeling ecstatic about it...Some of the classmates(Hindus) did not like it at all and we argued argued and argued ...Well, we were not so matured to be politically correct etc at that point of time..So words flew accross like daggers and whoever got killed got killed..

Communal riots broke out between Hindus and Muslims after that..The infamous Bombay riots happened..So much of destruction happened, all in the name of Religion, or is it for the Vote Bank?

Today when I think back, I dont feel so strongly about it..I am not even sure why I felt like that at that point of time...Yeah, perhaps family influence...In fact I am confused if it was really a genuinely emotional thing that happened or merely a political stunt to garner the Hindu Votes...Sometimes I even feel that these kinds of things are mindless, when so many people are dying without food, shelter and clothing, all those people could think of was religion and a temple ?

After that, my family has permanently become BJP supporters, (except my grandfather of course, who is a freedom fighter and still is under the illusion that Congress is nothing but Indian National Congress...😆...)And I think its true for most of the Hindu families..

Now I would love to learn your views on this one of the turning point incidents of India...

1.Do you support the incident, condemn it or dont care about it?

2.What were your feelings about the incident at that point of time?

3.What do you feel today about it?

4.Some argued that it brought back all the Hindus together..Do you agree??

5.Is it important to claim back all the Hindu temples that are now under the Islamic structures?

6.Did BJP get benifitted because of this or did it work against?

7.Congress obviously condemned the act, but later when Shri.P.V.Narasimha Rao became the PM, he also did not take any action against the possible offenders, why???Do you think he was secretly supporting the incident, or he also did not want to lose the Hindu Vote Bank?


Note:Since religion is obviously one of the points here, I suggest we refrain from  making any strong, hurting statements...I was able to post this topic only because I trust my DM friends to be sensible enough to know where to draw a line...Thank You😃

Cheers,
Raksha😃


Edited by raksha.l - 17 years ago

Raksha, Very interesting topic. I think I was 13 when it happened and I agree with you. It was a turning point in Indian history and rise of RSS and Shiv sena.

1.Do you support the incident, condemn it or dont care about it? I condemn it the same way I condemned Buddha demolition in Afghanistan.

2.What were your feelings about the incident at that point of time? I was too young to form a strong opinion about the incident then but I know that my family was not supportive of it. We have always been against religious fanatic parties though I still believe that BJP is a strong party with educated leaders and it should not associate with any sort of fanaticism.

3. What do you feel today about it? I would go with what I wrote in point 1. I am also amused that some leaders in BJP had the nerve to condemn Buddha demolition in Afganistan.

4. Some argued that it brought back all the Hindus together. Do you agree?? No. How can any sort of violence bring anyone together? What it did was made the Hindu-Muslim rift more obvious or I would say widened the rift.

5.Is it important to claim back all the Hindu temples that are now under the Islamic structures? No. India's history is not just associated with Hindus. We have had so many invasions and rulers and we have adapted so much from all those that everything has blended into one Indian culture. Now we can't separate one from another. We know some Mughal rulers were aggressive and destroyed many Hindu temples like in Kashmir which was primarily a Hindu state with maximum temples but all destroyed by invaders, the point here is if we go back to taking revenge then there is no end to it. Whom are we avenging? They are one of us. So we should move on and work on more important issues like poverty, peace and education.

6.Did BJP get benifitted because of this or did it work against? It benefited for them because they could brainwash some Hindus but in the long run it didn't as many realized later that it was just their trump card to be used in every election.

7.Congress obviously condemned the act, but later when Shri.P.V.Narasimha Rao became the PM, he also did not take any action against the possible offenders, why???Do you think he was secretly supporting the incident, or he also did not want to lose the Hindu Vote Bank? He had many other things to work on and he was one of the corrupt leaders in the party working along with some godman. He probably didn't want to create a new issue and bring the focus on him.

I know it is a sensitive and controversial topic but I have sincerely replied to all questions. My personal views to questions Raksha posed.

Hmm, I don't know much of the issue. In fact, only heard about it some time back. I don't know much of political parties or leaders either or the history behind it all. BUT what I do know is that people can be so stupid; why are they fighting over a piece of land? And worse are the people who make issues out of it, and make others fight.

My suggestion -- make a mosque and temple at the same place; a sign of peace between hindus and muslims. Heck, even add more religions, and make it a sign of UNITY of all religions. 😊

Only one religion -- humanity, all the drama that goes in the name of religion is pure nonsense. It's unfortunate people get trapped in such rubbish.

Persy

Excellent topic raksha and Excellent post Maya!  I pretty much have nothing to add.  😳.  I was 19 when that happened.   the riots that followed and then got repeated and then the bomb blasts that shook bombay made some of us hostel dwellers go hungry for few days.  How can I ever forget?

This content was originally posted by: Raksha

1.Do you support the incident, condemn it or dont care about it?

I condemn violence of any sort and especially in the name of God / religion. 

2.What were your feelings about the incident at that point of time?

I was very mad and I was irritated by Hindus rejoicing it as if it was some glorious victory.

3. What do you feel today about it?

The same, but with time, I have moved on.  Nithari killings probably stirred me more perhaps..

4. Some argued that it brought back all the Hindus together. Do you agree??

Not at all

5.Is it important to claim back all the Hindu temples that are now under the Islamic structures?

No.  History cannot be changed.  It teaches us not to repeat the mistakes, doesn't it? Demolishing what we have now, doesn't seem sensible to me.  As maya said, there are so many other things we could and should focus on!

6.Did BJP get benifitted because of this or did it work against?

momentarily perhaps.

7.Congress obviously condemned the act, but later when Shri.P.V.Narasimha Rao became the PM, he also did not take any action against the possible offenders, why???Do you think he was secretly supporting the incident, or he also did not want to lose the Hindu Vote Bank?

politics.. so could be any reason

Sorry if the views have hurt anyone's feelings.  It was not my intention to criticize any political party / their agendas.

.Edited by ani11 - 14 years ago

This content was originally posted by: raksha.l

Communal riots broke out between Hindus and Muslims after that..The infamous Bombay riots happened..So much of destruction happened, all in the name of Religion, or is it for the Vote Bank?
It was for a Hindu Vote Bank, Hindu's are too self rightous to buy into it😆😆😆

Today when I think back, I dont feel so strongly about it..I am not even sure why I felt like that at that point of time...Yeah, perhaps family influence...In fact I am confused if it was really a genuinely emotional thing that happened or merely a political stunt to garner the Hindu Votes...Sometimes I even feel that these kinds of things are mindless, when so many people are dying without food, shelter and clothing, all those people could think of was religion and a temple ?

After that, my family has permanently become BJP supporters, (except my grandfather of course, who is a freedom fighter and still is under the illusion that Congress is nothing but Indian National Congress...😆...)And I think its true for most of the Hindu families..

Now I would love to learn your views on this one of the turning point incidents of India...

1.Do you support the incident, condemn it or dont care about it?
Did not then, condemned it at that time
2.What were your feelings about the incident at that point of time?

Hated it, I live in a riot zone, so I knew someone is gonna get hurt, b'cos I know more Hindu's get killed in that area in a communal riot and no-one give's a sh*t, but yeah they hold prayers for people who died in the riots in Mumbai😉

3.What do you feel today about it?
Today I think Advani was right in exploring the Hindu Vote Bank. It is proven Hindu vote bank does not consolidate when there is a reservation outbreak, this tells this is the only way a Hindu vote bank can be consolidated, Abhorable, Certainly, but you cant sit around and see everyone else go create their own vote banks and gain due to it

Today there is a Muslim Vote bank

There is a Vote Bank for minorities

To counter that you need a Hindu Vote Bank
4.Some argued that it brought back all the Hindus together..Do you agree??
Actually it did not,  some Hindu's hate this/some love it
5.Is it important to claim back all the Hindu temples that are now under the Islamic structures?
No, Again IMO this was an experiment of Advani to consolidate the Hindu Vote Bank, and he got momentary success, obviosuly they won the election due to it, if this is the only thing to attract the Hindu Voter, then it might be
6.Did BJP get benifitted because of this or did it work against?
Both, they won the election, but they turned some people totally against them, by doing this, they knew they were going to lose the Muslim vote, they figured out how much of Hindu vote they gain and how much was not there to gain
7.Congress obviously condemned the act, but later when Shri.P.V.Narasimha Rao became the PM, he also did not take any action against the possible offenders, why???Do you think he was secretly supporting the incident, or he also did not want to lose the Hindu Vote Bank?

Everybody wants an issue, nobody wants to solve it. Narsimha Rao played it safe, if he would have taken any action against the offenders, it would have squarely turned the partial Hindu vote against them forever

Now Rahul Gandhi can come back and say, if my family was in power it would never have happened, he is playing to his Muslim Vote Bank right there, offcourse nobody finds it objectionable😉

comments have been tempered as much as possible

This content was originally posted by: raksha.l

Yes, I am talking about the reconstruction of the Ram temple which is more famously called the demolition of Babri Masjid😃,on Dec26 1992

I think I was in 7th grade when this incident happened and I remember feeling ecstatic about it...Some of the classmates(Hindus) did not like it at all and we argued argued and argued ...Well, we were not so matured to be politically correct etc at that point of time..So words flew accross like daggers and whoever got killed got killed..

Communal riots broke out between Hindus and Muslims after that..The infamous Bombay riots happened..So much of destruction happened, all in the name of Religion, or is it for the Vote Bank?

Today when I think back, I dont feel so strongly about it..I am not even sure why I felt like that at that point of time...Yeah, perhaps family influence...In fact I am confused if it was really a genuinely emotional thing that happened or merely a political stunt to garner the Hindu Votes...Sometimes I even feel that these kinds of things are mindless, when so many people are dying without food, shelter and clothing, all those people could think of was religion and a temple ?

After that, my family has permanently become BJP supporters, (except my grandfather of course, who is a freedom fighter and still is under the illusion that Congress is nothing but Indian National Congress...😆...)And I think its true for most of the Hindu families..

Now I would love to learn your views on this one of the turning point incidents of India...

1.Do you support the incident, condemn it or dont care about it?

I am ok... dont condemn it...nobody treated it like a masjid for quite a while...

2.What were your feelings about the incident at that point of time?

ok a place which was called a masjid but wasnt visited by anyone was being claimed by some for something... I thought it was ok

3.What do you feel today about it?

you mean whatever remains of it today?

4.Some argued that it brought back all the Hindus together..Do you agree??

Possibly

5.Is it important to claim back all the Hindu temples that are now under the Islamic structures?

Is this hypothetical question? It depends on what temple are you referring to.....

6.Did BJP get benifitted because of this or did it work against?

Its saying more like construction companies getting benefit out of earthquake...

7.Congress obviously condemned the act, but later when Shri.P.V.Narasimha Rao became the PM, he also did not take any action against the possible offenders, why???Do you think he was secretly supporting the incident, or he also did not want to lose the Hindu Vote Bank?

I hate secularists since they use religion to manipulate situations.... and people


Note:Since religion is obviously one of the points here, I suggest we refrain from  making any strong, hurting statements...I was able to post this topic only because I trust my DM friends to be sensible enough to know where to draw a line...Thank You😃

Cheers,
Raksha😃

Great post Raksha.

Difficult to answer whether I condemned it or not.  Breaking of any religious structure being used for religious purposes or community purposes is wrong, but in this case, this was a old forgotten monument used by none.  It was more symbolic of changing times, it was symbolic of a change in the "tolerant" hindu.  Was this change good or bad, difficult to concise in a small post, for the factors and facts involved are voluminous and complex and intricately interwoven. 

I did not condemn the act then, I condemn the tamasha they have now made it to be. 

Did it bring the hindus together?  In some ways, for the vote bank, it did, in some parts of India.  The other minorities enjoyed the advantage of "vote bank" politically, which was not so with hindus.  In some parts of India, a Hindu vote bank was formed.  In a larger sense, maybe not, because it widened the chasm and accelerated the growth of religious intolerance in the country.

Structures which were demolished and desecrated so many years back, there is really no sense in reclaiming them back.  It was a place of worship earlier, ti is a place fo worship now. 

BJP definitely benefitted from this act.  In many parts of India, where the voice of the average Indian was dimmed because of the aggresive shout of the minority community, these average citizens found a loud speaker to vent their frustrations.  BJP captured or tried to capture this vote bank.  Did they manage to retain the vote back?  Answer is possibly a NO.

PVR and everyone else want to so play it safe.  Vote Bank matters.  Every day, the population of Bangla Desh refugees in Mumbai is increasing.  But it is welcomed by the Political parties for these become fixed / permanent vote banks. 


The average Indian remains confused, in my opinion.  While he does want to lash out and fight and claim his right, he does not want to do so at the cost of others and this dilemma is what the political parties prey on.  It matters not if the Indian is hindu or muslim.  It is this confusion again, which perhaps, create a Babri Masjid, or a Mumbai riot, a Godhra or a Best Bakery.  Sometimes, it also creates the 93 blasts.

This content was originally posted by: raksha.l

Note:Since religion is obviously one of the points here, I suggest we refrain from  making any strong, hurting statements...I was able to post this topic only because I trust my DM friends to be sensible enough to know where to draw a line...Thank You😃

Cheers,
Raksha😃

Since there's a warning, I won't venture to present my whole unadulterated views.😃 I supported it then, don't regret it now, the rest you can guess.

Edited by souro - 17 years ago

This content was originally posted by: raksha.l

1.Do you support the incident, condemn it or dont care about it?

I don't support the way they have done but it was an unfinished task of Sardar Patel.He should have done it immediately after Independence😊!

2.What were your feelings about the incident at that point of time?

 I was small then.I though some dangerous thing happend.I remember my efforts in trying to know the details about that issue,as I did'nt understand the biiiiiiiiiig articles in THE HINDU and Eenadu I requested my family members to tell about in detail.Even in our class we discussed about it as if we knew about it😃

3.What do you feel today about it?

 This is of no importance to me.There are much more important issue than this! People don't have basic facilities like Food,Shelter and Private toilets in somany rural areas of India still! Still they use Mother Nature's Lap for those things🤢!

Politicians can construct or destruct these type of religious things when they feel confident that they have provided basic aminities to the people in rural and urban India.

4.Some argued that it brought back all the Hindus together..Do you agree??

Donot Know! I wonder if people are divided to that extent on religion basis in INDIA!😕

5.Is it important to claim back all the Hindu temples that are now under the Islamic structures?

If they want to do that next in the que is Qutub Minar which is actually a Vishnava Stupa!

The list is endless! But it makes no sense! Those things happend due to foreign invasions,now the peace of the land should'nt be disturbed by destroying those monumental structures into pieces!(Haah! I feel as if I spoke a dialogue of NTR films😆)

6.Did BJP get benifitted because of this or did it work against?

 It did'nt get benifitted to the extent it expected.However our family turned towards to BJP after the Congress PResidentship went to Sitaram Kesari! We like BJP- Ram Janma Bhoomi issue(or religion)!

Infact BJP got notorious after this Ram Janma Bhoomi Issue!

7.Congress obviously condemned the act, but later when Shri.P.V.Narasimha Rao became the PM, he also did not take any action against the possible offenders, why???Do you think he was secretly supporting the incident, or he also did not want to lose the Hindu Vote Bank?

 I don't think Rao did for Vote Bank! May be its his personal choice😛! May be he did all these to protect his Chair!




Cheers,
Mythili